March 3, 2026

Around the Spectrum – Inside the IEP: What Schools Are Responsible For (with Leila Farshchian)

Walking into an IEP meeting can feel confusing, especially when you’re unsure what’s required, what’s flexible, and how decisions are made. In this episode, Leila Farshchian, a special educator and Board Certified Behavior Analyst, breaks down what parents can realistically expect from the IEP process.

We cover the basics: who should be in the room, how outside diagnoses interact with school evaluations, and the legal timelines that protect families. We also talk about goal setting and service intensity — what meaningful instruction looks like, how to spot inconsistencies across ABA, speech, and OT, and why collaboration matters when progress feels slow.

We address common pressure points, including fading supports, protecting unstructured times like lunch and assemblies, and deciding when inclusion is appropriate. You’ll also hear how to approach transitions between grades or schools to protect continuity of services and preserve hard-earned progress.

This is a practical, steady conversation designed to help parents navigate the IEP process with more clarity and confidence.

Support the show

Subscribe to Around the Spectrum wherever you listen so you don’t miss future conversations.

If this episode was helpful, leave a review. It helps other parents and professionals find the show.

Learn more at
https://www.aroundthespectrum.com

Because when we sit at the same table, we understand more and judge less.

00:00 - Welcome And Guest Introduction

01:18 - Layla’s Path From Homes To Schools

04:42 - First IEP: Who’s There And Why It Matters

08:20 - What The IEP Legally Guarantees

12:30 - Using AI And Questions To Decode Goals

16:45 - Consistency Across Teams And Settings

20:24 - When You Feel Outnumbered In Meetings

24:36 - Fading Supports Without Causing Regression

29:00 - Inclusion Versus Structured Classrooms

33:20 - Slow Progress: What To Ask And Measure

36:45 - Planning Big Transitions And Data Handoffs

WEBVTT

00:00:00.640 --> 00:00:13.279
Hi everyone, it's Wendy from Around the Spectrum, where parents, pros, and those in between pull up the chair for honest conversations, grounded guidance, and real stories about raising and supporting autistic kids.

00:00:13.439 --> 00:00:15.119
I'm your host, Wendy Manganero.

00:00:15.359 --> 00:00:22.160
As a parent, marketing leader, and longtime autism ally, I know how overwhelming and isolating this journey can feel.

00:00:22.320 --> 00:00:27.120
That's why we're here, because when we sit at the same table, we understand more and judge less.

00:00:27.280 --> 00:00:29.039
Let's get into today's episode.

00:00:29.199 --> 00:00:36.399
Today we're joined by Professor Layla Farcian, who isn't here to talk at us, but to talk with us.

00:00:36.640 --> 00:00:47.920
Layla is a certified special educator and board certified behavior analyst with over 30 years of experience to bring children on the spectrum across school, home, and community settings.

00:00:48.079 --> 00:00:57.200
She holds a master's degree in applied behavior analysis from Columbia University and has led public school autism programs among the top in New Jersey.

00:00:57.359 --> 00:01:08.879
Layla is the founder and CEO of CircaTera and has built educational systems and data-driven programs that support children, families, and professionals nationwide.

00:01:09.040 --> 00:01:10.239
Welcome, Layla.

00:01:10.799 --> 00:01:11.760
Thank you, Wendy.

00:01:11.840 --> 00:01:17.120
Thank you for having me on and grateful to be in conversation with you and with everybody listening.

00:01:17.439 --> 00:01:18.640
Yes, just gonna be great.

00:01:18.719 --> 00:01:26.799
So today we are discussing what parents can actually expect in an IEP from the inside of the system because I know there's so much confusion.

00:01:26.959 --> 00:01:38.640
I realize that where you are in the world or where you are in the US or Canada may look a little different, but I think that there are some top expectations that parents can have and reciprocal communication.

00:01:38.719 --> 00:01:40.159
And so we're gonna dive into that.

00:01:40.319 --> 00:01:49.680
So the first thing I'd love to know is like a little bit about your background, because you say you've worked in autism education and ABA since the late 90s in both school and home settings.

00:01:49.760 --> 00:01:57.200
So can you share a little about your path and what you've seen change over the years and how schools support children on the spectrum?

00:01:57.599 --> 00:01:58.799
Absolutely, sure.

00:01:59.040 --> 00:02:08.639
So I started off my applied behavior analytic interventions journey in home programs and really witnessed firsthand what families deal with.

00:02:08.879 --> 00:02:23.280
What happens behind closed doors of a therapy session, the tension behind siblings, spouses, families not being able to attend birthday parties and social events due to the challenges that were presented to them with the diagnosis.

00:02:23.840 --> 00:02:33.360
Also, the day-to-day being able to handle anything from going shopping or just hygiene challenges or getting a haircut because it was super scary for the child.

00:02:33.599 --> 00:02:41.919
So I started in the homes, and I think that was something that when all of us, when we reflect back on our journey, we think, you know, what brought us to this point?

00:02:42.000 --> 00:02:48.080
And I would say that was a gift to start in the homes, really be part of the family's day-to-day.

00:02:48.240 --> 00:02:59.360
I even went on vacation with a family once and had to do therapy sessions because we wanted to avoid regression, which is a challenging factor when spend so much time and energy helping a child.

00:02:59.520 --> 00:03:02.560
One week on vacation should be relief from life.

00:03:02.719 --> 00:03:06.000
But for a family who's dealing with autism, it's scary.

00:03:06.159 --> 00:03:07.840
It could result in a loss.

00:03:08.080 --> 00:03:09.680
It's almost like a sacrifice.

00:03:09.840 --> 00:03:13.599
So, you know, having witnessed all those things, and then I went into the schools.

00:03:13.759 --> 00:03:18.639
And so I went into the schools with a sensitivity of who's on the other side picking up the child every day.

00:03:18.800 --> 00:03:19.680
What do they expect?

00:03:19.759 --> 00:03:21.120
And how do we communicate?

00:03:21.280 --> 00:03:30.000
And I started my first program in New Jersey and then went on to my fifth program now is Learner's Compass, which is my private practice.

00:03:30.240 --> 00:03:36.400
So built five programs in the top three, the third one won top three because we were highly collaborative.

00:03:36.960 --> 00:03:41.280
And so being in schools and also going into homes, it's been a journey.

00:03:41.360 --> 00:03:48.719
And I would say being on the school side, there's a lot I can I can share and talk about as we're talking about IEPs.

00:03:49.439 --> 00:03:50.159
Thank you for that.

00:03:50.240 --> 00:03:52.560
And the other day I went to go get my hair done.

00:03:52.639 --> 00:03:54.000
And my son's 20 now.

00:03:54.240 --> 00:04:00.000
And but there was a time when leaving the house was just so overwhelming to me.

00:04:00.159 --> 00:04:04.479
And a parent came in and they were sitting behind me, but the child was not having it.

00:04:04.560 --> 00:04:08.719
I and I don't know if there was a diagnosis or not, but the mom was so upset she had to leave.

00:04:08.879 --> 00:04:16.959
And I think education around like those fears of like going on vacation or aggression and or just taking your child out to be able to do something.

00:04:17.120 --> 00:04:20.399
I've really felt for this mother because they were not equipped.

00:04:20.560 --> 00:04:22.959
They were just not equipped on how to handle it.

00:04:23.120 --> 00:04:29.680
And so I quietly said something, but I understand that as another parent because that's the most awful feeling in the world.

00:04:29.920 --> 00:04:34.720
If you're not expecting it and your new parent to it is the reactions from everybody else.

00:04:34.879 --> 00:04:41.839
So I appreciate you saying that because sometimes parents think they have to hide at home because of the way their child reacts.

00:04:42.079 --> 00:04:55.120
Let's talk about like if you're new into the IAP system, because a lot of times, especially if you come into early intervention, you may just have had a diagnosis, your child may be going into pre-K or kindergarten.

00:04:55.360 --> 00:04:58.480
What should they really realistically expect?

00:04:58.639 --> 00:04:59.839
Who should be in the room?

00:05:00.000 --> 00:05:01.120
What's the purpose?

00:05:01.279 --> 00:05:05.199
And what tends to surprise families in that first one?

00:05:05.920 --> 00:05:06.560
Sure.

00:05:07.040 --> 00:05:10.560
To empower families, I just I think empowering is really key.

00:05:10.800 --> 00:05:12.560
Ask a couple of simple questions.

00:05:12.720 --> 00:05:19.199
One of them would be: if I make a request, how many days do you legally have to respond to me?

00:05:19.519 --> 00:05:21.279
In New Jersey, it's 30 days.

00:05:21.439 --> 00:05:27.839
A written request to the director of special services requires a written response within 30 days.

00:05:27.920 --> 00:05:29.120
It has to be in writing.

00:05:29.279 --> 00:05:31.519
I, you know, many families just don't know that.

00:05:31.680 --> 00:05:52.160
So I would say when a child is newly diagnosed and the system begins, and then the call is made to the school to find the appropriate program and support by age three, because now I assume the early intervention path has been taken, the state has been involved, but now it's time for the school to take over.

00:05:52.639 --> 00:05:54.639
What do their programs look like?

00:05:54.879 --> 00:05:57.600
Are they equipped to do autism treatment?

00:05:58.000 --> 00:06:00.639
Do they have a BCBA on board?

00:06:01.120 --> 00:06:06.720
How does that BCBA collaborate with OTPT and speech and school psychology?

00:06:07.199 --> 00:06:09.199
Who will be doing the evaluation?

00:06:09.839 --> 00:06:11.040
Will they do it at home?

00:06:11.199 --> 00:06:12.639
Will they do it in the daycare?

00:06:13.199 --> 00:06:22.879
And then once the determinations are made, does the child need one-to-one or do they need an inclusive environment?

00:06:23.439 --> 00:06:32.319
So there's just of these questions, but basically taking a look to see the infrastructure that's already in place in the schools.

00:06:32.800 --> 00:06:40.319
Some of them have one-to-one programs, some of them have 12 children in a room, some of them have six children in a room.

00:06:40.800 --> 00:06:46.560
What's the ratio of providers in the room and educators to the children?

00:06:47.040 --> 00:06:48.879
Is it an inclusive environment?

00:06:49.439 --> 00:06:50.959
So it really is very important.

00:06:51.120 --> 00:07:03.040
But what I would highly recommend is going into those kinds of meetings with the physician and the medical diagnosis and the report.

00:07:03.519 --> 00:07:13.839
Because if it's level one, two, or three, the questions are going to have to be directed as is the school equipped in its current structure?

00:07:14.000 --> 00:07:18.800
And if not, what will it do to welcome the child?

00:07:19.040 --> 00:07:23.519
How will it shift things around to make those accommodations?

00:07:24.720 --> 00:07:33.680
I love those questions because parents don't know what to ask, and it seems all very overwhelming when you're getting all sorts of information and you don't know what is the right thing to kind of respond with.

00:07:33.839 --> 00:07:44.480
And I like the idea that the expectation of the 30 days, because it if the school has 30 days, depending on the school district, that doesn't mean they're ignoring you.

00:07:44.639 --> 00:07:50.800
They're just allotting themselves the time to be able to answer and kind of get things together on the back side of that.

00:07:50.959 --> 00:07:58.639
So when it when it comes to obviously, there's a lot of confusion sometimes of what an what an IEP can actually do.

00:07:58.800 --> 00:08:08.240
So from your perspective, what are the common misunderstandings parents have about what the school is actually responsible for and what it's not?

00:08:09.120 --> 00:08:11.439
I mean, the IEP is a legal document.

00:08:11.600 --> 00:08:22.399
So if it says speech three times a week, OT four times a week, ECBA four hours a week, all of those are binding types of expectations that are set for the school year.

00:08:22.639 --> 00:08:30.399
Oftentimes, parents will take it home and review it with a professional before signing it, which is always a great idea.

00:08:30.720 --> 00:08:39.039
So it has great information in it because the people have evaluated the child and have proposed plans.

00:08:39.519 --> 00:08:47.679
However, a parent knows their child for many, many years before the professionals see them for the half hour or 45 minutes.

00:08:47.919 --> 00:08:52.240
So the assessment should be reviewed too, because this is the first time they're getting to know the child.

00:08:52.320 --> 00:08:59.279
And some children are just not responsive to strangers testing them, whether they're neurotypical or neurodivergent.

00:08:59.840 --> 00:09:00.240
Right.

00:09:00.399 --> 00:09:10.399
So I think really just making sure reading those documents very clearly at home and is the assessment true to the child's capabilities?

00:09:10.559 --> 00:09:12.159
Is it reflective of it?

00:09:12.399 --> 00:09:21.120
And is it going to result in the right amount of services and the right amount of support for the full school year?

00:09:21.360 --> 00:09:33.600
One thing I want to emphasize with autism and IDD is that every moment should be a teaching opportunity and neuroplasticity, because the brain has plastic from age two to three to four to five, most plastic before age five.

00:09:33.759 --> 00:09:36.000
That's when we want to be most intensive.

00:09:36.639 --> 00:09:43.120
So one of the things that I have a this is a follow-up question for you is that my son was diagnosed years ago.

00:09:43.200 --> 00:09:49.679
I had the diagnosis, I brought him to the pre-K, and they didn't want to see that back then.

00:09:49.840 --> 00:09:54.000
They literally took his diagnosis and put it in the drawer and went, we don't go by that.

00:09:56.639 --> 00:10:06.960
So what can a parent expect if they are already bringing their diagnosis to the school system as opposed to asking the school system to kind of make that diagnosis?

00:10:07.120 --> 00:10:14.960
I know that there's still a plan, but how much are they supposed to work together with the diagnosis the parent brings in themselves?

00:10:16.080 --> 00:10:19.759
The school really responds to the diagnosis that's been brought in.

00:10:20.559 --> 00:10:24.960
And in addition to that, then you had asked the question about what is the school responsible for?

00:10:25.120 --> 00:10:26.559
What are we responsible for now?

00:10:26.720 --> 00:10:31.759
Insurance covers ABA at home and it covers speech OT and PT at home.

00:10:31.919 --> 00:10:38.480
And I know it's challenging to put together a program, like a it's like a whole other business for the child at home, like a homeschool.

00:10:38.720 --> 00:10:49.679
But what if they go to school till three and they need support at home, or if we can get something from the state as well to support in New Jersey, we have perform care.

00:10:50.000 --> 00:10:52.960
Every state has something where they support at home.

00:10:53.919 --> 00:10:57.600
Maximize the support, especially in the early years.

00:10:57.840 --> 00:11:01.360
Maximize what's available and find out what is available.

00:11:01.759 --> 00:11:02.960
I think that's really key.

00:11:03.120 --> 00:11:12.480
The school is responsible for if there's an outside diagnosis really adhering to what will support progress.

00:11:13.519 --> 00:11:26.639
If they have to make the determinations themselves, if they have the experience, if they have the team that's specializes in IDD and autism, well, then great.

00:11:26.960 --> 00:11:29.120
But that's something to look out for.

00:11:29.440 --> 00:11:30.799
Yeah, I think that's important.

00:11:31.120 --> 00:11:35.200
I appreciate you because I'm telling you, it was a different world 20 years ago when I brought my son in.

00:11:35.440 --> 00:11:42.080
I look at the support families can get now, and I'm so grateful for them to be able to get what they do.

00:11:42.240 --> 00:11:46.639
It makes all the difference in the world for a parent who already is thinking, am I doing enough?

00:11:47.200 --> 00:11:58.960
IEPs, they're filled with, you know, for those that don't know, an IEP is an individualized education plan because there's a lot of different alphabet soup when it comes to getting services.

00:11:59.200 --> 00:12:04.320
And so they're kind of filled with benchmarks and goals and data language.

00:12:04.480 --> 00:12:18.159
How should parents think about goals in a way that feels practical and meaningful, not just technical, and kind of educate themselves on the alphabet soup so that they know what they're actually reading?

00:12:20.240 --> 00:12:23.679
So we live now in an AI available world.

00:12:23.919 --> 00:12:31.360
I would take that IEP, maybe scrub it over the personal information and upload it and find out what it all means and how it all helps.

00:12:31.600 --> 00:12:36.720
I would leverage AI because I wouldn't have said that a year ago, but I would leverage AI at this juncture.

00:12:36.960 --> 00:12:42.960
Advocacy for the child takes a lot of effort, but also feeling comfort that there's a lot of resources available.

00:12:43.120 --> 00:12:51.120
Connecting with your child study team and saying, you know, just explain to me what is OT proposing, occupational therapy, what is speech proposing?

00:12:51.279 --> 00:13:08.000
And do they see that my child can't ask for their needs, you know, or they can't ask me to open a jar or get a cookie, or they get frustrated, just basic things that I have reported that I'm having trouble with on the day-to-day.

00:13:08.320 --> 00:13:10.080
Is this reflected in here?

00:13:10.320 --> 00:13:18.720
The developmental milestones when it comes to anything from communication to social to behavior.

00:13:19.039 --> 00:13:21.440
Where are these addressed within here?

00:13:21.600 --> 00:13:28.960
And the child study team lead really they're obligated to sit down and I would make that request.

00:13:29.200 --> 00:13:30.159
They're there for you.

00:13:30.320 --> 00:13:32.240
Make that request, sit down and go through it.

00:13:32.559 --> 00:13:35.120
These are my daily struggles, these are the challenges I'm seeing.

00:13:35.200 --> 00:13:36.080
Are they addressed?

00:13:36.320 --> 00:13:38.480
Sometimes it's a hundred-page document.

00:13:39.360 --> 00:13:46.159
It's a or a 50-page, or it's a big document to be able to sort through it can be overwhelming.

00:13:46.720 --> 00:13:54.080
So ask for that support and just read through each section to see what is occupational therapy doing, what is speech doing.

00:13:55.919 --> 00:13:59.440
And look for consistencies and inconsistencies.

00:14:00.399 --> 00:14:18.799
So if the applied behavior analysis team and the board certified behavior analyst from ABA, they're teaching the child bunny and speech is teaching the child rabbit, and the child has 10 words in their lexicon, well, maybe your child won't want to show up to work because they're just confused.

00:14:19.120 --> 00:14:21.200
It's just the nuances of inconsistencies.

00:14:21.279 --> 00:14:32.080
I think that's why we've developed Circothera, which is our platform for disabilities, care providers, and those who scenes so families don't have to.

00:14:32.480 --> 00:14:36.559
It flags and pinpoints those kinds of inconsistencies.

00:14:36.879 --> 00:14:40.960
However, that document should outline some of them.

00:14:41.679 --> 00:14:48.320
But one thing that we were very successful at in the program that won in the state was very simple.

00:14:48.480 --> 00:14:55.039
We met with the families once a month and we talked about these things and we shared our data across providers.

00:14:55.519 --> 00:15:00.799
OT, speech, ABA, they coordinated care more than once a month.

00:15:00.879 --> 00:15:02.720
We coordinated care on a regular basis.

00:15:02.960 --> 00:15:03.919
So ask about that.

00:15:04.080 --> 00:15:12.960
Ask about, you know, when you're reading that document, look for consistencies, inconsistencies, duplications that are not necessary or sometimes very necessary.

00:15:13.440 --> 00:15:23.840
Yeah, I think looking for those things, just consistency and consistency, duplication, and then following up on a regular basis with the team throughout the year.

00:15:24.159 --> 00:15:26.639
So that you can be consistent at home too.

00:15:26.799 --> 00:15:28.559
That's that's gonna help.

00:15:29.120 --> 00:15:30.240
That's really important.

00:15:30.480 --> 00:15:44.000
What I like about all of this is that the first letter of that is individualized, is that making sure it works for your family and your child, and not going, well, this is what works for everybody else, but really being able to kind of hone into that.

00:15:44.080 --> 00:15:51.600
Because I think that's one of the most important pieces that sometimes is forgotten is that it's supposed to be individualized to your child.

00:15:51.840 --> 00:16:08.080
So on the opposite side, though, because not look, there's the fact of the matter is that there's some really great school districts to do this and some other ones that are not, you know, we have a wild ride through the US of like what what schools do.

00:16:08.320 --> 00:16:22.960
If parents, and I've led parent groups where they feel frustrated at their IEP, they feel like they're not being heard, they feel like they're kind of doing an uphill battle with the school of what they see the need is compared to what the school sees the need as.

00:16:23.200 --> 00:16:36.159
So if they feel like they're outnumbered or intimidated or unsure of themselves in the IEP, what would you want them to understand about their role as a parent in the room?

00:16:37.039 --> 00:16:40.720
I remember walking into one of the IEP meetings.

00:16:41.039 --> 00:16:44.480
It was 15 of us and then the mom and the dad.

00:16:45.039 --> 00:16:46.240
How difficult.

00:16:47.440 --> 00:16:57.039
And some of the educators are tired and they've been there for too long, and they're just maybe don't have this, they've been it's almost normalized.

00:16:57.200 --> 00:17:01.679
But for the family, this is brand new and there it's overwhelming and it's challenging.

00:17:02.639 --> 00:17:14.559
You have some compassionate educators and some who are another day of the job and been doing this for 30 years, and they they're faced with all these different types of people in the same room.

00:17:15.680 --> 00:17:18.480
Just know that you know your child best.

00:17:20.720 --> 00:17:24.640
And it's it's a one and a half or two hour meeting, sometimes one.

00:17:24.960 --> 00:17:35.680
And the greatest thing that you can do is listen and hear what everyone's doing, have your list of questions ready, but take that document home.

00:17:36.079 --> 00:17:37.599
You're not under pressure.

00:17:38.160 --> 00:17:38.480
Okay?

00:17:38.960 --> 00:17:44.160
And everybody in special education at some point or another went into it because they care.

00:17:45.039 --> 00:17:53.680
Establishing those relationships from the very beginning with them, the ones who are ready to answer your questions or gonna hold your hand through it.

00:17:53.920 --> 00:18:04.559
Find the one or two or three or four in that room, and your child study team members should really be setting up some time to one-on-one go over those questions with you as well after the meeting.

00:18:04.880 --> 00:18:08.880
So go into that meeting, just know that this is not the final meeting.

00:18:08.960 --> 00:18:10.559
You don't have to sign then and there.

00:18:11.359 --> 00:18:17.599
Listen, ask your questions, take your documents, review them at home, ask for a follow-up meeting.

00:18:18.079 --> 00:18:26.960
You know, really take time to digest it, leverage the tools that we have in our technology world, maybe even bring in another professional to look at it with you.

00:18:27.680 --> 00:18:35.359
Because ultimately, if we know what is available to us, we don't have to feel overwhelmed or scared because it is a new world to navigate.

00:18:35.680 --> 00:18:39.519
And I would say I don't want to reduce how important it is.

00:18:39.680 --> 00:18:43.359
It is a very important document because it determines a whole year.

00:18:43.519 --> 00:18:45.039
So don't sign it quickly.

00:18:45.279 --> 00:18:48.880
Take that time because you wanted to address all the things.

00:18:49.039 --> 00:18:54.079
And if you feel like it's not enough OT or not enough ABN, not enough oversight, ask.

00:18:55.759 --> 00:19:13.039
And the other, I guess this is going to be a follow-up, and it's based on kind of what I've seen and heard again, the going to parent support groups, that type of thing, is for the families who have children who are higher functioning, just for different different functions at them.

00:19:13.359 --> 00:19:21.599
And because children meet different milestones at different times, and then suddenly, like mid-year, they do the review and they go, Yep, we're good.

00:19:21.759 --> 00:19:23.920
We don't this child doesn't need that anymore.

00:19:24.240 --> 00:19:26.000
How does the parent address that?

00:19:26.079 --> 00:19:31.039
That it that's fine, but it to step it down as opposed to like, nope, they're not going to get an aid last.

00:19:31.359 --> 00:19:32.400
That's kind of what happened to me.

00:19:32.480 --> 00:19:39.920
But I'm certainly not the only parent who's gone through that, is like they've met whatever milestone they are, because the school system's a little bit different.

00:19:40.079 --> 00:19:46.640
And going from having whatever the support is to none can cause regression too.

00:19:46.799 --> 00:19:53.359
So, how do families navigate like a step-down approach when the school is saying, nope, they've met all these milestones?

00:19:53.680 --> 00:19:54.960
I would want documentation.

00:19:55.119 --> 00:20:00.079
I would request to come in and visit and maybe even bring in a specialist to do a review.

00:20:00.319 --> 00:20:02.480
Because we used to invite parents in once a month.

00:20:02.559 --> 00:20:09.599
They would come in and see our data, they would come in and see what's going on in the classroom, they would come in and meet with us, and all those questions were answered.

00:20:09.680 --> 00:20:15.359
So ask the questions and ask for a transition that makes sense.

00:20:15.599 --> 00:20:18.640
So sometimes it's good news.

00:20:18.880 --> 00:20:32.480
However, it can, you know, if you take away resources too quickly, it confuses the child and it confuses everybody around the child and even their social groups, and it's just support.

00:20:32.559 --> 00:20:34.240
And those are supports that are in there.

00:20:34.400 --> 00:20:37.920
It's almost like taking away the crutches too soon when the leg hasn't healed.

00:20:38.079 --> 00:20:39.920
Well, the healing doesn't happen then, right?

00:20:40.000 --> 00:20:41.599
Then you have to go back and get surgery.

00:20:41.759 --> 00:20:42.799
We don't want that.

00:20:43.119 --> 00:20:45.519
So it's good news.

00:20:45.759 --> 00:20:51.039
So maybe it should be approached from a positive standpoint, but a very strategic plan.

00:20:51.519 --> 00:20:56.160
Instead of doing it right away, can we do this over the next six to 18 months?

00:20:56.480 --> 00:20:59.359
You're saying my child doesn't need a para and he's in second grade.

00:20:59.440 --> 00:21:06.319
Well, what's the harm in having it taken away at third grade when he's got the rest until 12th grade to be independent?

00:21:06.559 --> 00:21:07.839
Why do it in such a way?

00:21:08.000 --> 00:21:13.279
And why not do it in the morning or the afternoon when he is maybe in the afternoons he's more successful?

00:21:13.440 --> 00:21:15.839
The morning is more academic and he needs support.

00:21:16.000 --> 00:21:19.200
Whatever it might be, take a look at the day with them.

00:21:19.440 --> 00:21:21.599
Find out why they're proposing this.

00:21:22.400 --> 00:21:25.200
Ask the questions is it strategic?

00:21:25.680 --> 00:21:27.359
Is it a fading plan?

00:21:27.519 --> 00:21:30.559
Or is it a rip and replace type of situation?

00:21:30.799 --> 00:21:33.359
I don't ever recommend a rip and replace.

00:21:33.440 --> 00:21:34.400
I really never do.

00:21:34.559 --> 00:21:37.839
So just hone in on that and take your time.

00:21:37.920 --> 00:21:41.039
Again, you have 30 days to for New Jersey's 30 days.

00:21:41.119 --> 00:21:45.519
I don't want to say to blanket 30, but find out in your state how much time, what's the communication channel?

00:21:45.680 --> 00:21:46.640
What's expected?

00:21:46.799 --> 00:21:50.319
So if they're going to propose this, you have time to respond.

00:21:50.480 --> 00:21:53.920
They can't just do it without your consent, especially if it's in the IEP.

00:21:54.000 --> 00:21:55.119
That's your legal dog.

00:21:56.079 --> 00:21:59.680
You can say, I'm not consenting to this until I learn more, or thank you for.

00:22:00.240 --> 00:22:01.039
The great news.

00:22:01.680 --> 00:22:10.160
But before I consent, I'd like to ask some questions, really review if you're fading the para what time of day?

00:22:10.400 --> 00:22:11.839
Does he still need support at lunch?

00:22:11.920 --> 00:22:13.279
Is there going to be lunch buddies?

00:22:13.440 --> 00:22:16.319
Will the speech come in and support some of that?

00:22:18.720 --> 00:22:18.880
Yeah.

00:22:19.039 --> 00:22:26.640
Especially for those who have sensory issues, because like they may not need the classroom support, but what if they still need support when they do everything in the auditorium together?

00:22:26.960 --> 00:22:43.119
Like those type of little things where if you just yank that IEP, it's not that they may just need support in special areas where that could be part of the step-down program, too, which is really an important piece because kids function in different different crowds, different noise levels, all of that.

00:22:43.359 --> 00:22:45.519
I do want to say one thing before we move on.

00:22:45.759 --> 00:22:58.480
I have to say it takes a seasoned professional to work with children who are less severely impacted and have more nuances in their social skills and then their behaviors.

00:22:58.799 --> 00:23:04.720
Just because when the diagnosis is severe, well, we have a formula and we follow it.

00:23:04.960 --> 00:23:10.799
But when there's those children who are outside of the box, they're on the other side of the spectrum.

00:23:11.039 --> 00:23:17.599
And to the naked eye, they might look just a little not typical and they could be subject to bullying.

00:23:17.759 --> 00:23:20.480
They could be subject to isolation, depression, anxiety.

00:23:20.640 --> 00:23:28.160
How is that differentiated from the normal child who nor a typical child is subject to anxiety and all of those things?

00:23:28.319 --> 00:23:33.440
Because yeah, to the untrained eye, it can kind of just get lost.

00:23:34.480 --> 00:23:37.359
But I think parents have the best instincts.

00:23:37.599 --> 00:23:44.799
We've been given this, I believe, God given instinct to know our child, to take care of our child and really be there to understand our child.

00:23:45.039 --> 00:23:52.400
So if they're giving you the news that services to be faded, okay, so there's good news, but you brought up a really good point.

00:23:52.480 --> 00:23:53.839
Like, what about the auditorium?

00:23:54.000 --> 00:23:55.519
What about the social skills?

00:23:55.680 --> 00:23:56.480
What about the playground?

00:23:56.880 --> 00:23:58.960
Faded, okay, to what extent?

00:23:59.200 --> 00:24:00.160
How and where?

00:24:00.480 --> 00:24:02.000
That's the questions to ask.

00:24:02.160 --> 00:24:07.119
How and where, I think, and and and and what's the pace we're gonna go in.

00:24:07.759 --> 00:24:08.960
And that's all important.

00:24:09.039 --> 00:24:16.240
And I ended up actually taking my child out of public stool and bringing him into private so that he could have those special nuances because he needed them.

00:24:16.480 --> 00:24:20.319
Like, you know, more breaks during the day, don't sit them near a window.

00:24:20.640 --> 00:24:30.480
We had all of that built in because he wanted to be there, but these little things kept him have the ability to actually succeed better as opposed to being lost.

00:24:30.559 --> 00:24:41.279
And I think that's the thing is like because you know your child, as you're saying, when you're able to advocate for those little things, which to the naked eye, because I've trust me, I've had plenty of people go, he's just a boy.

00:24:41.440 --> 00:24:43.759
I can't tell you the most I have heard he's just a boy.

00:24:43.839 --> 00:24:49.519
And I'm like, well, yes, but as a parent, I can see some of the things that other people may not.

00:24:50.000 --> 00:24:59.440
And so I think that that's really important to be kind of your own child detective to know what is really going to support them so that they're successful in wherever they can go.

00:24:59.680 --> 00:25:09.599
So that kind of brings us to this next question of this collaboration from the school side, because you've worked for the school district and you've worked in schools from the school sides.

00:25:09.839 --> 00:25:20.799
What looks like a collaborative parent as opposed to one that they feel like we want to be able to help, but it doesn't feel like there's collaboration on both sides?

00:25:21.039 --> 00:25:22.799
It's a very good question.

00:25:23.119 --> 00:25:28.000
It's a very good question because it takes both.

00:25:28.319 --> 00:25:34.960
Sometimes schools are not equipped for those whose diagnoses are severe.

00:25:35.200 --> 00:25:40.640
And so they may be defensive, it might be difficult for them, they have to find outside placement.

00:25:40.880 --> 00:25:48.799
A parent has to advocate for their child, they know their child well, and they come in with most likely a diagnosis or receiving a diagnosis.

00:25:49.039 --> 00:26:00.319
A collaborative parent is someone who the school team will see as has the questions, has the documentations, asks the fair amount of questions, and asks follow-up questions.

00:26:00.480 --> 00:26:02.400
I would say that's expected.

00:26:03.680 --> 00:26:06.799
Don't shy away from asking all the questions and wanting clarity.

00:26:07.039 --> 00:26:14.240
However, it becomes contentious sometimes in situations where recommendations are made and other children are getting hurt.

00:26:14.480 --> 00:26:19.920
That's when I think school personnel start to get their back is up against the wall.

00:26:20.160 --> 00:26:29.599
Because in a classroom of maybe 20 children or even 15, if a child elopes, if a child has aggressions, that's not an environment where they can learn.

00:26:29.920 --> 00:26:32.400
Inclusion is being pushed too quickly.

00:26:32.640 --> 00:26:35.359
That's one area where I've seen a lot of contention work.

00:26:35.519 --> 00:26:40.079
Inclusion is pushed too quickly by either the parent or the educators.

00:26:40.240 --> 00:26:53.279
When inclusion is just becomes like a one-on-one where the child's in the back of the classroom at one point, and now it looks like an invisible cubby, but they're just in the classroom because someone has requested too strongly that they stay there.

00:26:53.440 --> 00:26:55.680
But the child is already so frustrated.

00:26:55.839 --> 00:26:59.440
So they're eloping, they're aggressive, and other children are affected by it.

00:26:59.680 --> 00:27:11.440
One of the greatest things that I find that's a point of contention is when is inclusion appropriate, and when is a more structured nurturing environment appropriate?

00:27:11.599 --> 00:27:15.920
And agreement on that seems to be challenging.

00:27:16.240 --> 00:27:22.319
So, what we did to solve for that in that program that I mentioned to you is we brought the parents in.

00:27:22.480 --> 00:27:23.599
So they saw the data.

00:27:23.759 --> 00:27:25.759
We shared data with them, we sent data home.

00:27:25.920 --> 00:27:32.799
So for educators, if there are any educators listening to this, I would say share information before you get questions.

00:27:34.160 --> 00:27:39.920
Share goals, share progress along the way because parents celebrate in that progress.

00:27:40.240 --> 00:27:44.319
But if there's challenges, share those too because they can help problem solve.

00:27:44.400 --> 00:27:51.279
Maybe they can tell you that look, I changed the diet, I tried a new medication, you know, we've had difficulty at home with going to bed.

00:27:51.440 --> 00:28:07.359
And that's why he's like, so just sharing information along the way before it becomes contentious, being proactive really helps us not get into this reactive, cyclic, contentious because now the child is really just left of center at that point.

00:28:09.039 --> 00:28:09.599
Absolutely.

00:28:09.759 --> 00:28:11.359
And it's interesting you said that.

00:28:11.599 --> 00:28:18.880
So for my son, we really didn't do medication, but as he got older, it was apparent we needed to try it.

00:28:19.039 --> 00:28:22.480
And it at the one, the first one we put him on did not work.

00:28:22.640 --> 00:28:39.839
And I think that that's important because parents, if you are trying at like different medications, bedtimes, any of that stuff, when if you tell the school they can be proactive about what they're saying, because we noticed it at home, and I'm like, well, like I have to notice.

00:28:39.920 --> 00:28:47.279
I mean, it was such a profound change of like this kid who's usually somewhat happy go lucky to like ready to like rage on everybody.

00:28:47.440 --> 00:28:54.799
And so I think that that's important because it helps the parent, helps the school system to understand as opposed to putting other kids at risk.

00:28:55.039 --> 00:29:14.000
The other thing I was gonna ask you, and and I think that this it kind of goes along with this question where the school's coming to the parent going, we really would like to have some testing so that that becomes more of a collaborative because they're noticing things that the parent, because now the parent the child is out in school and public at the school and doing activities.

00:29:15.519 --> 00:29:23.759
If they're flagging there's something different, that's an opportunity to support that child.

00:29:24.960 --> 00:29:31.279
Whether you're flagging something is off or they're flagging something as off, that's an opportunity to find help.

00:29:31.839 --> 00:29:36.480
And pushing away help doesn't make the problem go away.

00:29:37.200 --> 00:29:40.480
And I'm gonna go back to the neuroplasticity of the brain.

00:29:40.960 --> 00:29:46.640
We can't miss time, we can't lose time because things only get worse, they never just resolve on their own.

00:29:46.960 --> 00:29:56.319
So if something's being flagged, it's because they're noticing it and they're noticing it because they have other children to compare against, they have experience to compare against.

00:29:57.119 --> 00:30:02.000
So if they're noticing and they're flagging it, what solutions are they also offering?

00:30:03.119 --> 00:30:05.359
They have access to solutions.

00:30:06.000 --> 00:30:18.880
The child study team members, the school psychologists, social workers, they have access to state resources, they have access to school resources, they have access to community resources.

00:30:19.200 --> 00:30:22.960
Those are things that parents may not readily know.

00:30:23.279 --> 00:30:26.640
And yes, it's heartbreaking and it's so hard to hear.

00:30:26.799 --> 00:30:30.960
The child is not performing well, but it's an opportunity to help.

00:30:31.039 --> 00:30:36.400
And it's an opportunity to gain access to all their knowledge that they're willing to share.

00:30:36.559 --> 00:30:40.000
And hopefully that's where it's coming from, is that they're not just presenting the problem.

00:30:40.240 --> 00:30:40.400
Yeah.

00:30:40.480 --> 00:30:50.240
And this kind of like to what you just said about getting help and in our plastic plasticity, is when progress kind of feels slow to the parent.

00:30:50.319 --> 00:30:52.079
And this is this is common in ABA.

00:30:52.240 --> 00:30:53.759
This is not common just to schools.

00:30:53.839 --> 00:30:54.720
I need to say this.

00:30:54.880 --> 00:30:56.240
This is common in ABA.

00:30:56.400 --> 00:30:59.839
And so how does that work when the progress feels slow?

00:30:59.920 --> 00:31:07.200
And how should families think about progress, especially in the realm of like areas like communication or regulation or social skills?

00:31:07.440 --> 00:31:08.559
Every child is different.

00:31:08.640 --> 00:31:09.279
I know this.

00:31:09.599 --> 00:31:19.920
But again, like when it feels slow to the parent, how do you express that there may be a lot of progress, but it doesn't feel like it sometimes in the parent eye?

00:31:20.319 --> 00:31:22.000
I have so much to say about that.

00:31:22.720 --> 00:31:28.799
So we were responsible to do 1,000 learning units or repetitions when we were doing our internship at Columbia University.

00:31:29.039 --> 00:31:29.839
1,000 a day.

00:31:29.920 --> 00:31:31.200
That's 5,000 a week.

00:31:31.359 --> 00:31:35.119
I've gone into schools where they're doing 150 a week of repetition.

00:31:35.599 --> 00:31:38.720
Sometimes progress is slow because the system's slow.

00:31:38.880 --> 00:31:42.240
Sometimes progress is slow because we're moving at the child's pace.

00:31:42.640 --> 00:31:45.599
Find out how many goals are they working on actively?

00:31:45.759 --> 00:31:49.119
How many hours a day are they actively working on those goals?

00:31:49.359 --> 00:31:50.720
Who's working on those goals?

00:31:50.880 --> 00:31:52.640
Is it somebody without experience?

00:31:52.880 --> 00:31:55.279
Are they overseen by somebody who has experience?

00:31:55.440 --> 00:31:57.599
And then what's the north star of every goal?

00:31:57.759 --> 00:32:00.000
Because goals are broken down into very small steps.

00:32:00.240 --> 00:32:02.880
And sometimes those small steps have to be celebrated.

00:32:03.599 --> 00:32:06.480
They just have to be celebrated, and that's the child's pace.

00:32:06.880 --> 00:32:13.359
There's nothing we can do about that except put in tactics and motivations and partner up to get them moving faster.

00:32:14.160 --> 00:32:16.559
It's a complex process.

00:32:17.039 --> 00:32:22.559
But if OTPT and speech and ABA work together, things should move faster.

00:32:22.880 --> 00:32:24.640
So look for collaboration.

00:32:25.119 --> 00:32:27.519
Do they have the right number of goals?

00:32:27.920 --> 00:32:30.720
And do they have the right people doing those goals?

00:32:32.000 --> 00:32:36.960
I think those are key things that you said, because again, every child is different.

00:32:37.039 --> 00:32:46.640
But if the IEP is like they get 30 minutes a day of somebody for ABA and they require more than that, or they require somebody 30 hours a week.

00:32:46.799 --> 00:32:50.960
So I think that that's those key things is asking those questions is really important.

00:32:51.200 --> 00:33:01.599
And to kind of further this conversation, because every child starts with if you get a diagnosis early, you go through early intervention, but then eventually your child is going to go to middle school and high school.

00:33:01.759 --> 00:33:15.359
And those are significant changes for a child on the spectrum because it could have suddenly they have to switch classes or you know, even if it's like lunch more than they were in elementary school.

00:33:15.599 --> 00:33:29.519
So, how does a parent prepare as they are leaving one school to another to make sure that that IP transitions the services when they go, because it could be very drastic for some of our children?

00:33:29.920 --> 00:33:44.000
I am going to bring up circa therapy and why we created that, because from classroom to classroom, through the life cycle of the child, all the information's automated and it easily transitions and everybody has visibility, including the parents, to the data.

00:33:44.319 --> 00:33:48.400
So, what is their system for visibility?

00:33:48.559 --> 00:33:53.440
What is their system for transition and automation and accountability of data?

00:33:53.759 --> 00:34:00.079
Ask that from the very beginning because they will transition classroom to classroom each year.

00:34:00.319 --> 00:34:04.079
They will even transition from para to para mid-year.

00:34:04.240 --> 00:34:11.119
And then what happens when it's time to go from pre-K to kindergarten and so on?

00:34:11.519 --> 00:34:15.360
So, what is their source for accountability?

00:34:15.519 --> 00:34:17.280
Is it Google Drive?

00:34:17.760 --> 00:34:20.159
Is it an automated, sophisticated system?

00:34:20.320 --> 00:34:21.360
They're available now.

00:34:21.440 --> 00:34:23.360
There's a few other systems similar to ours.

00:34:23.599 --> 00:34:28.480
We think we've done a great job of covering all that's needed for all stakeholders.

00:34:28.559 --> 00:34:31.760
That's why we spend so much time creating the platform.

00:34:32.880 --> 00:34:45.039
Automation and documentation should be key because if a child has been in a school for four years working on something and they go on their fresh slate all of a sudden, it's not fair to that child.

00:34:45.199 --> 00:34:49.119
The first three months are lost for everybody.

00:34:49.440 --> 00:34:56.719
So, what is their system that they have in place to make sure that everybody is in the know?

00:34:57.840 --> 00:34:59.519
There should be something.

00:34:59.840 --> 00:35:04.880
Yeah, because a lot can be lost in transition if everybody doesn't have the same information.

00:35:05.280 --> 00:35:09.280
And parents should not be even really responsible for that coordination of care.

00:35:09.440 --> 00:35:11.119
That's why we have automation.

00:35:11.199 --> 00:35:12.079
It's a burden.

00:35:12.239 --> 00:35:27.360
And if there are any educators on our audience and we can reach them, it's like they there are systems available right now in our technological world that allows for these kinds of processes to be taken off so parents can be parents.

00:35:28.159 --> 00:35:30.480
And I do think that's important to that point.

00:35:30.559 --> 00:35:38.400
Like, even if you move, there's got to be something that at least I you could say, can you give it to me so I can move?

00:35:38.639 --> 00:35:50.480
Because that move can completely uproot your child in the sense that suddenly they were getting this, and the new school system's like, Well, we don't really offer that, whatever the case may be.

00:35:50.639 --> 00:35:55.679
But if that IEP follows it and it was written, it has to follow us to the new school.

00:35:55.840 --> 00:36:02.719
So I think that's really important to be able to have that documentation and be like, this is what my kid needs, no matter where you go.

00:36:03.039 --> 00:36:08.320
And if you choose and it's appropriate, they could always now have meetings between the new teachers.

00:36:08.480 --> 00:36:11.840
I mean, if they're the same school, definitely they should be meeting.

00:36:12.000 --> 00:36:15.280
The new speech therapist should meet with the old speech therapist, and you can ask that.

00:36:15.360 --> 00:36:17.199
Like, what are the transition plans?

00:36:17.360 --> 00:36:21.119
How many meetings will there be between the teachers, the therapists?

00:36:21.360 --> 00:36:24.159
And if I'm going to a new place, can we schedule a meeting?

00:36:24.400 --> 00:36:25.599
Now we're in a Zoom world.

00:36:25.679 --> 00:36:26.960
So that's quite easy to do.

00:36:27.280 --> 00:36:30.159
And I think parents need to hear that because sometimes they don't know to ask.

00:36:30.239 --> 00:36:33.199
And I think it's really important for them to know what they can ask.

00:36:33.360 --> 00:36:35.519
So I love this last question I call it the wisdom.

00:36:35.599 --> 00:36:48.320
See, so if you were sitting across from a parent tonight who feels overwhelmed, unsure, or even adversarial as they enter the IEP meeting because all of those feelings could happen.

00:36:48.639 --> 00:36:54.639
What would you want them to understand first about navigating the system with clarity and confidence?

00:36:54.880 --> 00:37:00.159
I would say information is empowering, it brings calm, it reduces anxiety.

00:37:00.480 --> 00:37:03.360
So do you know the communication channels?

00:37:03.599 --> 00:37:08.960

Leila Farshchian,

BCBA

Leila Farshchian, MA, BCBA is a certified special educator and Board Certified Behavior Analyst with more than 30 years of experience in autism education and behavioral intervention. She holds a Master’s degree in Applied Behavior Analysis from Columbia University’s Teachers College.

Over the course of her career, she has developed and led multiple autism programs, including one recognized among the top programs in New Jersey by the State Board of Education. Her work focuses on educational systems design, behavioral health methodology, and collaborative care across schools and community settings.

Leila is the founder and CEO of Circa Thera and has contributed to initiatives that advance educational and behavioral health practices across diverse learning environments. She also serves in international education and health leadership roles supporting global community development efforts.

Around the Spectrum – Inside the IEP: What Schools Are Responsible For (with Leila Farshchian)

New to Around the Spectrum?

Around the Spectrum - Welcome to Holland: Finding Beauty in a Differe…